| Author | Message | ||
     Anonymous Rating: N/A |
When I view interlaced DVDs on my PC monitor with shutter glasses I get a shimmering effect because of the pixel difference in left and right images (each image is missing every other line of pixels). I was wondering if any one knows if the DVDs in the sensio format have the same problem? And what exactly is this format? I read some where it was over-under stretched, and then I read some where else it's side-by-side stretched. My main interest is for viewing on a PC monitor, not so much for viewing on a TV set. Thanks! | ||
| Peter Wimmer Rating: N/A |
Sensio DVDs use side-by-side format and it doesn't suffer from the aliasing problem of most interlaced DVDs. By the way, it is possible to create interlaced DVDs without aliasing problems. Instead of dropping lines, downscale it to half height and then interlace it. | ||
| Scott Soland Rating: N/A |
Hi  So therefore is the Sensio format a good as page flipping. I want to get rid of flicker too. I am looking at the DepthQ but also wonder if two Sony VPH 3031 or VPH12xx's would work. Would they work with two complete projectors and poloroid lenses for passive? | ||
| Robert Teft (Rrrrob) New member Username: Rrrrob Post Number: 4 Registered: 5-2006 Rating: N/A |
Why does my sensio copy of Spy Kids work with my usual shutter glasses? Aren't they different? I thought they were the same but now I'm confused.... | ||
| Charles Arrants (Charles) New member Username: Charles Post Number: 4 Registered: 5-2006 Rating: N/A |
Rrrob: You didn't say which software stereoscopic player you're using to view your Sensio DVD. If it's Peter Wimmer's player, that program will automatically detect whether an inserted DVD is in Sensio or standard interlaced format, and then proceed to display either input format in whatever output format you have selected (presumably page-flipped mode). I'm not aware of any other stereoscopic player that will do this automatically. (With the DepthQ Server software, the DVD input format has to be set manually.) | ||
| Robert Teft (Rrrrob) New member Username: Rrrrob Post Number: 6 Registered: 5-2006 Rating: N/A |
I am talking about a standard DVD player. The copy of Spy Kids I have states it is in Sensio format, but it seems to work fine with my Razor 3D shutter glasses equipment... | ||
| Charles Arrants (Charles) New member Username: Charles Post Number: 5 Registered: 5-2006 Rating: N/A |
Rrrob: I need more information about your setup in order to provide an explanation to you. Are you watching your 3-D DVDs on your television or on your computer? If you are using your television, it is impossible to playback a 3-D Sensio disc correctly unless you have the proprietary $3,000 Sensio decoder unit connected. If you are using your computer, you MUST have a software stereoscopic DVD viewing program installed (such a Peter Wimmer's Player or the DepthQ software program), or you won't get 3-D video playback from any type of 3-D DVD. Which software program are you using? The shutter glasses have NOTHING to do with the specific type of 3-D image being viewed. All the glasses do is separate the left and right images appearing in the viewer or television screen. | ||
| Peter Wimmer (Peter_wimmer) New member Username: Peter_wimmer Post Number: 6 Registered: 5-2006 Rating: N/A |
If the DVD works in 3D on your television using a standalone DVD player, the DVD must be in field-sequential (= interlaced) format. It cannot be Sensio. Maybe the manufacturer put the wrong disc in the DVD box!? | ||
| Howard Fath (Ladude) New member Username: Ladude Post Number: 1 Registered: 8-2006 Rating: N/A |
I have the same spy kids 3d dvd, and it says on the back of the DVD case, "Sensio 3D version for full frame 3D (requires Sensio 3D processor)" I too would like more info as to the difference between the field sequential unit available at Razor 3D, and the Sensio unit. | ||
| Charles Arrants (Charles) New member Username: Charles Post Number: 6 Registered: 5-2006 Rating: N/A |
Howard: If you want to play a Sensio 3D DVD on your television set, you will HAVE to use the proprietary Sensio processing hardware unit, which is quite expensive (about $3,000). The $30 Razor 3D "Video Viewer Stater System" works only with field-sequential 3D DVDs. If you want to play a Sensio 3D DVD on your computer's CRT monitor (or with a 3D-capable digital projector), you can get a page-flipped stereoscopic image using a software program like Peter Wimmer's Stereoscopic Player and a pair of standard shutter glasses connected to your graphics card via a VGA bypass cable for a total cost of around $100. Wimmer's player will playback both Sensio and field-sequential 3D DVDs in page-flipped format, and the resulting images look exactly the same --despite the advertising hype, there's NO visible difference in the stereoscopic image quality between Sensio and field-sequential at the standard DVD image resolution. If you have the choice of buying a DVD movie in either Sensio or field-sequential format, I recommend that you buy the field-sequential version. The field-sequential DVD will be notably cheaper, and you can play it on both your computer and your televsion without the $3,000 processing unit. (In my opinion, 3D DVDs look better on the computer monitor because of the absence of visible flickering, which is obvious on an NTSC or PAL television.) | ||
| Howard Fath (Ladude) New member Username: Ladude Post Number: 2 Registered: 8-2006 Rating: N/A |
Charles, Thanks for your quick reply. I have the Razor unit, which plays Spy Kids fine, other than the fact, that the picture is stretched vertically to fill the screen (making the kids taller and thinner than they should be)rather than letter box. So, what do you make of the statement on the box "Sensio 3D version for full frame 3D (requires Sensio 3D processor)" Just a mistake? | ||
| Charles Arrants (Charles) New member Username: Charles Post Number: 7 Registered: 5-2006 Rating: N/A |
Howard, I think the odds are 100% that you have a DVD that's formatted in field-sequential format and somehow ended up in the wrong box before it was shipped. If the disc had Sensio (side by side) formatting, you'd be seeing two separate, flat side by side images on your television screen, whether you viewed the screen through the shutter glasses or not. | ||
| Howard Fath (Ladude) New member Username: Ladude Post Number: 5 Registered: 8-2006 Rating: N/A |
OK, some good information, thanks a lot Charles. | ||
| Greg Kintz (Gregk) New member Username: Gregk Post Number: 2 Registered: 5-2006 Rating: N/A |
Actually, there ARE field-sequential DVDs with the Sensio name on them. These are Sensio's HQFS branded DVDs (High Quality Field Sequential) and are different from squeezed side by side Sensio DVDs. So remember- Sensio formatted DVDs - Sensio's squeezed side by side 3-D video format. HQFS DVDs - Standard field sequential 3-D video from Sensio. (Message edited by Gregk on August 20, 2006) | ||
| Charles Arrants (Charles) New member Username: Charles Post Number: 8 Registered: 5-2006 Rating: N/A |
It's true that the company selling Sensio DVDs in America has released some of its commercial DVD movie titles in both the Sensio (side by side) format and the so-called "HQFS" (actually standard interlaced field sequential) format. However, the field-sequential versions that I have seen ("Santa vs. the Snowman," "Misadventures in 3-D," etc.) don't have the word "Sensio" printed anywhere on either the disc or its clamshell box. | ||
| Howard Fath (Ladude) New member Username: Ladude Post Number: 6 Registered: 8-2006 Rating: N/A |
Yup, I'm looking at my copies of "Misadventures", and "Spykids" right now, and while both have the "hqfs" on them, only "Spykids" says anything about Sensio. So, will the Sensio unit play both formats, or just the side by side? | ||
| Charles Arrants (Charles) New member Username: Charles Post Number: 9 Registered: 5-2006 Rating: N/A |
Howard: The Sensio 3D Processor works only with Sensio formatted DVDs. The unit is connected between a standard DVD player and the television, and it converts the output from the DVD player into a proper 3-D display on the TV screen. Since standard DVD players put out an interlaced image by default, no converter unit is needed between the player and the TV for field sequential 3-D DVDs. (All the Razor 3D "Viewing System" really does is synchronize the shutter glasses with the television image.) | ||
| Howard Fath (Ladude) New member Username: Ladude Post Number: 7 Registered: 8-2006 Rating: N/A |
Thanks again Charles. So, why the $3,000 price tag on the Sensio unit, what makes it so special? Do they include anything with it other than the converter box? | ||
| Charles Arrants (Charles) New member Username: Charles Post Number: 10 Registered: 5-2006 Rating: N/A |
Howard: You can read the advertising hype about the processor at www.sensiome.com. Since the unit is necessary to view Sensio DVDs on television and its technology is proprietary, the company can charge whatever it wants. Despite the claims, there is no visible difference in image quality for 3D DVDs with the Sensio format compared to field-sequential format. In theory, the side-by-side format should be better because of the absence of potential interlacing artifacts, but you can't see any difference at 3D DVD resolutions (1/2 NTSC or 1/2 PAL). If you want to test that for yourself, compare the formats on your computer using Peter Wimmer's Stereoscopic Player (about U.S. $.50). | ||
| Charles Arrants (Charles) New member Username: Charles Post Number: 11 Registered: 5-2006 Rating: N/A |
Correction: The cost of Wimmer's Stereoscopic Player is about fifty dollars -- not fifty cents! | ||
| Howard Fath (Ladude) New member Username: Ladude Post Number: 9 Registered: 8-2006 Rating: N/A |
Charles, According to this link, Sensio does produce the HQFS stuff. http://www.sensio.tv/en/services/3D%20Encoding/Page.html Even if it was a better system, I couldn't see spending 3,000 bucks for it. Heck, for that price, it should be holographic and not even require glasses! | ||
| Peter Wimmer (Peter_wimmer) New member Username: Peter_wimmer Post Number: 9 Registered: 5-2006 Rating: N/A |
> The cost of Wimmer's Stereoscopic Player is about fifty dollars -- not fifty cents! Feel free to try the free demo version, which closes the video after 5 minutes. http://www.3dtv.at | ||
| Howard Fath (Ladude) New member Username: Ladude Post Number: 10 Registered: 8-2006 Rating: N/A |
Peter, I did try it, but while I do have shutter glasses, I do not have the dongle (I think that's what you call it) to connect them to my computer. Maybe I'll get everything I need one day. Hey, I like 50cents better, I'll take a dozen! | ||
| 3d-geek (Rrrrob) Junior Member Username: Rrrrob Post Number: 28 Registered: 5-2006 Rating: N/A |
Another question: I see where people are stating that the Sensio format is side-by-side...Does this mean I can take a side-by-side sensio formatted DVD, open the extracted video in Stereo Movie Maker (as input type side-by-side), and thus convert it to field-sequential???? | ||
| Scott Warren (Scott_warren) New member Username: Scott_warren Post Number: 16 Registered: 8-2006 Rating: N/A |
Yes you can, but you'd be losing 1/2 the vertical detail (and 1/2 the time resolution) in the process. You would be starting from a format which has already lost 1/2 the horizontal detail (through the anamorphic process)--and that's especially where it counts in 3D--, so I don't know if you'll be all that happy with the result... Scott | ||
| 3d-geek (Rrrrob) Junior Member Username: Rrrrob Post Number: 33 Registered: 5-2006 Rating: N/A |
Well, I converted Bugs! to field sequential, and while there was some resolution loss as you mentioned, overall the results were very good! Thanks for the input! | ||
| Rrrob (Rrrrob) Senior Member Username: Rrrrob Post Number: 160 Registered: 5-2006 Rating: N/A |
hi again folks: I am experimenting with side-by-side 3D format...I have found that the sensio standard is a 4:3 aspect ratio (standard TV definition)...so they are taking widescreen content, and squeezing the left and right streams into 1/2 the 4:3 screen. However, when i do this, i get the same, or worse, picture quality as interlaced. So I am not sure about the advantage of side-by-side 3D format over interlaced. Does anyone know if Stereoscopic player will work with two side-by-side streams, unsqueezed, in 1440 x 480 format? The first time I tried it, I got some sort of 'floating point' error from Stereocopic Player, but I am not sure if that was a DVD authoring error or if the program just rejected the format I tried.... | ||
| Fronzel Neekburm (Fronzel) New member Username: Fronzel Post Number: 20 Registered: 7-2009 Rating: N/A |
Stereoscopic player works with side-by-side formats, you just need to set the viewing format accordingly. Stereoscopic Viewer does have some nasty bugs, for example it had bad behaviour if i set my windows resolution to 640x480 (for legacy VR HMDs), zooming in when it shouldn't and so on. The floating point error never occured in my case, but sounds like a rather severe bug. Make sure that in the settings under "Decoder" there is configured a proper DVD decoder (YOu must have one installed, like "WinDVD" or so, Stereoscopic player does not bring one on its own). Also make sure you have the latest version. If nothing helps then i would think it is a bug you encountered, but generally speaking it can play side-by-side formats. | ||
| Peter Wimmer (Peter_wimmer) Junior Member Username: Peter_wimmer Post Number: 21 Registered: 5-2006 Rating: N/A |
The Stereoscopic Player supports side-by-side format (squeezed and non-squeezed) as well as the Sensio format. Sensio format is not squeezed side-by-side, but uses a special downsampling based on a checkerboard pattern to preserve details. The 'video decoder' setting in File|Settings|Decoder applies only for DVD playback (File|Open DVD), not for file playback (File|Open File). For file playback the decoders that should be used can be selected in the preferred filters list (also in File|Settings|Decoders). The recommended decoders for DVD playback are listed here: http://www.3dtv.at/Products/Player/DVDPlayback_en.aspx If the floating point error still occurs, even with the latest version 1.5, please let me know (send a bug report to office at 3dtv.at). I'm quite sure the problem only occurs with a certain configuration. (Message edited by peter wimmer on October 10, 2009) | ||
| Peter Wimmer (Peter_wimmer) Junior Member Username: Peter_wimmer Post Number: 22 Registered: 5-2006 Rating: N/A |
Here is a page that compared DVDs that are available both in Sensio and fieldsequential format: http://www.3dtv.at/Knowhow/Sensio_en.aspx | ||
| Tony Asch (Tone) New member Username: Tone Post Number: 18 Registered: 8-2006 Rating: N/A |
Rob, If you're willing to abandon DVD video as a playback medium, just put the left and right videos side by side in an AVI, MOV, WMV, etc... file, and Stereoscopic Player will handle it. If you're working with very high resolution, i.e. Blu-Ray conversions, you can stack the videos vertically, as most of the Windows video formats don't like horizontal resolutions above 2048. | ||
| Rrrob (Rrrrob) Senior Member Username: Rrrrob Post Number: 161 Registered: 5-2006 Rating: N/A |
right now i am trying to work within DVD standards, and trying to understand the best alternative (if any) to field sequential 3D format for resolution. I have two video streams (left/right) at 720 x 480 (when placed side by side=1440 x 480). I first tried squeezing the video horizontally, which worked, but i didn't perceive any video improvement--and it may have even been worse than field sequential. Is there any other advantage to going side-by side? My reason for sticking with DVD is that an .avi file for, say, a 90 minute movie is pretty huge. | ||
| Rrrob (Rrrrob) Senior Member Username: Rrrrob Post Number: 162 Registered: 5-2006 Rating: N/A |
If the floating point error still occurs, even with the latest version 1.5, please let me know (send a bug report to office at 3dtv.at). I'm quite sure the problem only occurs with a certain configuration. more than likely, the problem is with the DVD i authored...i have been doing a lot of experimenting lately | ||
| Tony Asch (Tone) New member Username: Tone Post Number: 19 Registered: 8-2006 Rating: N/A |
An AVI file of a 1440x480 video encoded using the Divx or Xvid codecs will be about half the size of a DVD (720x480) of the same duration and frame rate. The MPEG-4 codecs used in Divx and Xvid are much more efficient than the MPEG-2 codec used on video DVDs. A Windows Media file using their MPEG-4 codec will be similar in size and quality to Divx and Xvid. | ||
| Rrrob (Rrrrob) Senior Member Username: Rrrrob Post Number: 170 Registered: 5-2006 Rating: N/A |
apparently, above/below is the preferred method, as the Tri-Def software will accept that format while it doesn't play side-by-side format. In any event, the xvid codec is working nicely and the improvement in resolution is excellent compared to field-sequential format! | ||
| Rrrob (Rrrrob) Senior Member Username: Rrrrob Post Number: 171 Registered: 5-2006 Rating: N/A |
p.s.: check this out: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wl4JYY2isxE |
